Dough becoming wet after 24hour bulk fermenting and even more after 24 hour rise


Hello and thank you for your time,
I'll be asking questions about the Master Dough recipe (without starter) . I used all the recommended ingredient, weight and temp as stated in the master class PG31
The first two time I made this dough, the dough was wet through out the whole process until the stretching time where I dusted it with flour. The pizzas did come out outstanding :)

The third time I made this dough I reduced the ice water by 25grams. Day 1, making the dough. The dough came out nice and soft. Day 2, after the 24 hour bulk fermenting the dough became wet and sticky. I did the degassing and weighed each ball. Doing the stretching for each ball it was sticky to work with. I set it up for the 24 hour rise. Day 3, The dough balls were even more sticky and I had a hard time getting them off the pans. Once I dusted them with flour it was easier to work with. The pizzas still came out amazing. My question is why is the dough becoming wet in day 2 and 3?

For other information. When I'm stretching the dough it's easy to work with. A little to easy I think. When I'm doing the "slapping" technique it opens up a lot but, when I'm draping it over two loosely clenched fists it droops down to the counter like it has no support.

Thanks again in advance for your time and for the creation of this book!

With respect,
Peter

Peter K.
posted about 2 years ago

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Peter,

The Master dough recipe calls for 1% of Active Dry Yeast (ADY). That's quite a bit and I'm not surprised that at Day 3 the doughs hard to handle due to its stickiness.

What I think is happening is that the protease enzymes and acids of fermentation have a negative effect on the gluten matrix to the point where the water was released from its bond making the dough very sticky.

I'd try to reduce the yeast amount by .5%, which is still plenty, and limit the fermentation time to two days total. Also, increasing the salt amount might help.

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Mike K.
posted about 2 years ago

Here's a good article on what enzymes do in a dough. It's a long one but worth the read, imo.

http://www.foodproductdesign.com/articles/1994/11/understanding-enzyme-function-in-bakery-foods.aspx

- Mike   about 2 years ago


Hello Mike,
Thank you for the quick response. I'll try to reduce the yeast. When you suggested to limit the fermentation time to 2 day is what I don't understand. It's already one 24 hour period bulk ferment and another 24 hour period rise as separate dough balls. Then day 3 is bake the pizza.
Thank you for the article. It was very informative. If I understood it correctly reducing the yeast should also help with the weak dough support.

Peter K.
posted about 2 years ago

"If I understood it correctly reducing the yeast should also help with the weak dough support."

Let me ask you this first...what type of flour are you using?

- Mike   about 2 years ago


Hi Mike,
Here are my ingredient for the dough:
PFM Power High Gluten Flour - Unbleached Enriched
Diastatic Malt Powder
Maldon Flaked Sea Salt
Filippo Berio Olive Oil Extra Virgin
Red Star active dry yeast
70 grams warm water (80°F to 85°F)
200 grams ice water (This is what I modified from 225grams)
Everything is weight to the specific measurements as per Master Dough recipe (without starter)

Peter K.
posted about 2 years ago

The Power flour is an excellent flour. I use it also and it's just great stuff. After thinking about it a bit more, there several factors that could be the reason for that sticky dough.

Like i said above, enzyme activity could be one, then there's also the finished dough temp when coming off the hook from the mixer. If the dough's too warm and you put it in the fridge right after mixing it may 'sweat' or develop condensation without allowing the dough to properly cool off first. Too warm of a dough also allows fermentation to go on for longer than desired and the result may be an over fermented dough and can be excessively sticky.

I'd suggest you bench rest the dough for an hour to allow it to cool down before balling it up and placing it in the fridge.

- Mike   about 2 years ago


Hi Mike,
I follow the Master Dough recipe (without starter) exactly. I let the dough rest for a hour before it goes into the bowl for the 24 hour bulk ferment.

I'm going to first try to reduce the yeast as you suggested.

Then I'll try a letting the dough rest for another hour after I ball it as you also suggested.

Even though the book says to ball the dough then make the sauce. I didn't think it would matter but, I make the sauce first so when I'm done the 24 hour bulk ferment is completed. Then I go through the process of degassing and balling. May be it does matter. Doing that in the original order put the 1 hour rest period in.
I appreciate all the information you've been giving me and will take any other suggestions. I'll be making the next set of pizzas next week. I'll keep you updated.

Peter K.
posted about 2 years ago


Correction, I'll be making my next set of pizzas at the end of the month. I will update on how it went...

Peter K.
posted about 2 years ago


Hello,
I tried the suggestion of cutting the yeast in half and it seem to work. The dough coming out of the mixer was sticky but after the 24 hour bulk ferment it was not. I also let it rest for a hour after balling it before I put it in the refrigerator. I actually forgot to reduce the water to 200 grams from 225 like I did in the second try.

The dough not having any support is still a problem. It has no resistant at all. When I'm doing the "slapping" technique it opens up a lot but, when I'm draping it over two loosely clenched fists it droops down to the counter like it has no support. Unless anyone else has any other suggestion, I'm going to double the salt and see if that makes any difference. The reason I'm thinking the salt is watching Tony's youtube video when he was at Google. He adds triple salt to teach everyone to to throw pizza dough.

Thanks for reading...

Peter K.
posted about 2 years ago


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